Water power, pumps, and aquaponics?

[lutzhomestead]

Hi all!
Been crazy over on my end so I haven't had much time to see what others are posting, so there may be something on here on the topic I'm about to ask on.
Water power. Also, Aquaponics.
My questions are pretty much all theoretical since we don't have our "homestead" yet, but we are future thinkers and are constantly trying to think up ways to be self-sufficient once we are. Our latest topic of discussion has been aquaponics, and powering the pumps off grid.

Does anyone on here do aquaponics? Are you on grid or off?
The things we have been discussing is using a pond instead of tanks, this would reduce our need to provide food for the fish but also allow us to actually have fun fishing, plus, there wouldn't be as much of a need for oxygenation of the water in a pond setting. We were talking about about running a pipe from the pond to a greenhouse where our beds would be. The pipe would empty into a tank that would be suspended (possibly like a water tower) so that our sprinklers can be gravity/pressure fed and not have to worry about electricity there. Then beds would drain into a tank that would have a... I guess a return pipe of sorts? This would lead back to the pond, which wouldn't serve any real purpose except keeping water levels up. Our biggest quandary would be getting water through the siphon pipe and into the watering tank.

We aren't opposed to being tied to electric to run a pump to get water running through there, but, as my thinking goes, I don't want to have to rely on the grid to get water to my plants. We've been trying to think up ways to have a water powered generator, but also a backup hand powered pump. We were thinking of maybe creating a dam/waterwheel kind of generator, or maybe a cylinder with a T or something that would be in the pond with the mouth just a little lower than the surface and then the water would drain back out after falling into the cylinder and turning turbines or something? I don't know, it isn't a well defined plan haha

Does anyone have any experience with these kinds of things? Any tips, tricks, hints, how-to's? Any information would be appreciated! 

[Skandi]

I'm doubtful that running water from a pond would provide enough nutrients for plants. Ponds of the size you seem to be implying are pretty self regulating. I have several small ponds they all have fish and none are ever fed and the water is never changed, the natural balance keeps it all clean and keeps the nitrates down.
I have seen a system whereby a pond with a inflow (small stream spring etc) outflows over a gravel spillway where you then grow water-loving plants, like watercress.

[solargeek]

Solar powered aeration system.

We have a manmade (not by us) 8'-10' deep, 1.75 acre pond. Unlike what you said we needed 3 AERATORS to keep anough oxygen for the fish to live. Our pond guys (yes we used professionals for advice as this pond will help feed us as of this year) measured everything. Since the fish are so expensive until they begin to propagate on their own ($$$$ the first 2 years) we did what it took to keep them healthy. This will be our first year fishing after 2 years stocking. We did not want any "bubblers" other than at the surface so no fancy sprays, water attractions.

We also have predators so must use an organic black dye (looks like the sky but is called black) so that the eagles, hawks, egrets, great blue herons, and osprey don't eat our soon to be dinner.

Also, you will need algae controls (organic), and other additives to keep the pond in balance. Just leaving it alone as we did one year to see, did not end well.

But our pond is the delight of our lives and we built our home to see all of it every day. I cannot seem to get a picture of it on here. 

[Skandi]

Wow solar I cannot imagine fiddling with a lake like that! Everyone round here pretty much has one and no one aerates or anything, no algae control, just get a digger in every few years to pull the gunk out of the bottom. Why is your pond so anoxic? Lots of rotting matter? too hot? or too many fish? The only person with a big issue with his pond is a cousin who has ended up with some freshwater mussels in there, which means he has to get the digger in to haul them out every year or they take over.
The fisheries don't use anything either, well not that is noticable they certainly do not filter or aerate they may use some things to control algae but I don't think they do, doesn't look like it.

[solargeek]

Skandi ,
All lakes in WI have the same issues with algae buildup due to our extreme heat in summer and lack of turnover in the lakes. We live near a lake created by a huge river system, and we get actual warnings after the heat builds in July/August of NO SWIMMING, danger to dogs, and for goodness sakes do not let your boating guests be sprayed with the boat wake, etc. It is called blue-green algae. You can look it up. Aerators in our pond help solve that as does the black organic dye and enzymes we put in our pond.

Our pond has no outlet, and no 'inlet'. It is rain water driven. We do not use any fertilizers, no plowing or any disturbance around the pond to keep the 'loading of nutrients' into the pond low.

Here in the USA, no you generally cannot just take a backhoe to most ponds - you could be destroying wetlands.
IN our case we can because we can prove it is a contained system without any outlet. But WE ONLY HAVE A CLAY PACK FOR LINER AND IF WE PUNCTURE IT, GOODBYE POND.

Oh, and out solar system is HUGE so we power everything with it. We planned for all this, and a pole barn, greenhouse (still to be built), etc. At this point running a very spacious home (my DH loves big homes; I like small ones but I always lost on this....) WE ARE NET ZERO even with the 24/7 aerators running.

Ok hope I answered your questions.

[Skandi]

Yes heat seems to be the answer how do "wild" ponds and fish manage?. yeah we can do anything to ours (other than dig new ones) and as they are "natural" and have no liners poking at them doesn't do any harm. We looked at solar but the payback here is longer than the life expectancy of the panels since they dropped the best subsidies.

[spacecase0]

do you have wind where you live ?
if so, might want to look at windmill aeration
www.pondaeration.com/
www.koenderswindmills.com/

I don't have wind where I live, so it will not work for me,
I want to put in a small pond to give my fish more space,
plan on doing a direct run solar pump, so it will not run at night...
will be watching the fish very close the first few weeks to see if that will work or not.
past that I would set up a slow drip from a 5 gallon bucket on a short tower, but it seems like it would have to be filled again every few hours.
historically no one kept fish (that well) outside of a pond until electricity
all you have to do to aerate the water is to break the surface tension,
so I wonder if some sort of clockwork thing running a paddle hitting the water would do it.
or maybe one of the hydrophobic materials that might let the oxygen in directly that no one has ever tried before