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Post by feather on Apr 6, 2018 19:40:47 GMT
We have a 30 year old brick chimney with falling bricks. What is the correct thing to do? Get quotes from different 'mason's'? Research cements and rebuilding and do it ourselves? Use old brick or get new brick, what kind of cement, things to learn? Any advice is appreciated.
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Post by spacecase0 on Apr 7, 2018 0:44:19 GMT
most people I talk with talk about old VS new bricks want the look of one or the other.
not sure what demand is were you are, but old VS new might be a huge price change.
are you going to rebuild the entire thing ?
or just looking to stick a few loose bricks back in ?
there are some fantastic mortars that are meant for kilns if you are rebuilding entirely
then again, there is also ceramic bricks VS concrete bricks.
and you have to match the temperature expansion ratio of your bricks and your mortar if you don't want to wear out again
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Post by Weed on Apr 7, 2018 1:37:21 GMT
Cleaning out and re-pointing the joints is no big deal, but falling bricks suggests you have a bigger job on your hands. Q: Is the chimney completely outside on one side or the other & attached to the house or is it built within the footprint of the foundation, running up/out through the roof?
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Post by Jolly on Apr 7, 2018 1:57:45 GMT
Don't forget the integrity of the flue.
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Post by feather on Apr 7, 2018 13:03:31 GMT
no
more than a few.
The chimney is on a slant of the garage roof (one story), at the peak, but the majority of it is completely free standing-all four sides are exposed to the elements (not against another structure.)
The cap portion is a little wider (half the width of a brick) than the main part of the chimney. The cap portion is losing bricks (3 or 4 so far.) We didn't realize it was breaking down but we had 20-30 miles gusts this spring and that's when we started noticing them falling. (they sounded like small parts of the chinese space station hitting our roof)
The part that touches the roof, flashing, that is in perfect condition.
The cap part (if that is the right word) is built around the flues. The flues are fine.
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Post by Jolly on Apr 7, 2018 15:12:19 GMT
If the bottom is fine, it just sounds like more of a repointing job, or at worst just rebuilding a few feet.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2018 16:03:09 GMT
Just remember when you go to working on that cap portion, that the area of the exhaust port (cap) has to equal or exceed the area of the throat or the chimney won't draw smoke out. The throat being that area just above the firebox.
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Post by Weed on Apr 7, 2018 19:32:04 GMT
I saw my buddy today who specialized in building, repairing and sweeping chimneys for over 40 years and ran your problem by him. (I've got another 40+ building homes, roofing, etc...) Without seeing the chimney or knowing the fuel sources being used in the house (wood, oil, coal, gas), below is what we both agreed would be solid advice to avoid possible fire or smoke hazards
Because you've had a few brick come loose and actually fall out, the problem most likely started several years ago. His (our) advice would be to call a pro to come out to sweep the flue & make a thorough inspection just to make sure you're not overlooking anything that isn't obvious to the trained eye. The inspector will explain what needs to be done to make the repair, what caused it to fail (old mortar, moisture, extreme weather etc..), and give you an estimate. It may even be a inexpensive simple repair that might be worth hiring them. Either way, you'll know better that whatever you do, would be the same as they would do (if you choose to make the repair yourself). Same end results...no guarantee in hand, but more $ in your pocket
Speculating, but if the damage is limited to just the top few feet of the chimney only, it sounds like it could be a minor time/weather issue. Mortar crumbles & cracks over time and will eventually require maintenance, but it's easy to overlook something that is for the most part - out of sight until some damage is done. Water entering between the liner and chimney is perhaps the most common problem that happens when the top crown mortar fails & allows water to enter. The freezing and thawing cycles cause the damage as the moisture expands while freezing. Adding a chimney cap if you don't already have one is also a good idea that will keep a lot of moisture out of the flue.
ETA: get a written quote including the scope of work. Also, it would good idea to be on the roof at his side during the inspection to ask Qs if you think you might tackle the job yourselves
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Post by feather on Apr 7, 2018 20:10:58 GMT
If the bottom is fine, it just sounds like more of a repointing job, or at worst just rebuilding a few feet. The only missing bricks are on the top layer. There may be cracks in the first foot but I personally didn't go up and look at it. |
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Post by feather on Apr 7, 2018 20:12:54 GMT
Just remember when you go to working on that cap portion, that the area of the exhaust port (cap) has to equal or exceed the area of the throat or the chimney won't draw smoke out. The throat being that area just above the firebox. I honestly don't really understand what you are saying. When the fire place was in use, the smoke was drawn up, so that has me assuming (maybe wrongly) that if the cap was rebuilt in its current design, it would fall into your specifications. Thank you. |
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Post by feather on Apr 7, 2018 20:23:38 GMT
I saw my buddy today who specialized in building, repairing and sweeping chimneys for over 40 years and ran your problem by him. (I've got another 40+ building homes, roofing, etc...) Without seeing the chimney or knowing the fuel sources being used in the house (wood, oil, coal, gas), below is what we both agreed would be solid advice to avoid possible fire or smoke hazards Because you've had a few brick come loose and actually fall out, the problem most likely started several years ago. His (our) advice would be to call a pro to come out to sweep the flue & make a thorough inspection just to make sure you're not overlooking anything that isn't obvious to the trained eye. The inspector will explain what needs to be done to make the repair, what caused it to fail (old mortar, moisture, extreme weather etc..), and give you an estimate. It may even be a inexpensive simple repair that might be worth hiring them. Either way, you'll know better that whatever you do, would be the same as they would do (if you choose to make the repair yourself). Same end results...no guarantee in hand, but more $ in your pocket Speculating, but if the damage is limited to just the top few feet of the chimney only, it sounds like it could be a minor time/weather issue. Mortar crumbles & cracks over time and will eventually require maintenance, but it's easy to overlook something that is for the most part - out of sight until some damage is done. Water entering between the liner and chimney is perhaps the most common problem that happens when the top crown mortar fails & allows water to enter. The freezing and thawing cycles cause the damage as the moisture expands while freezing. Adding a chimney cap if you don't already have one is also a good idea that will keep a lot of moisture out of the flue. ETA: get a written quote including the scope of work. Also, it would good idea to be on the roof at his side during the inspection to ask Qs if you think you might tackle the job yourselves It sounds like solid advice that makes sense. This chimney is for a fireplace which is not used except once every few years for a christmas fire of wood, but not for heating. The problem is that it hasn't been used for many many years and we had it cleaned and inspected about 15 years ago. It probably is time to have it re-inspected. The cap is damaged (not a metal cap, the cement at the top around the flues) due to freezing thawing cycles, which is what you said. We could add a metal chimney cap on top of the rebuilt brick/cement cap and that makes sense. We made our first request from a mason for a quote. My mistake. We asked him to come out, let us know, we'd have an extension ladder available. Instead, he drove by, left a quote for $3500, he called it a proposal to rebuild the entire chimney. (there are no damaged or broken or missing bricks on 90% of the chimney) Then he sent 6 emails repeating this proposal in the period of 4 hours. In my quote request I specifically asked for him to look at the chimney--while we were here, with him, so we could decide what we wanted to do. His proposal seems exorbitant and he makes it a large project that seems a little overbearing. I'm going to look around for a chimney inspector to learn more about our chimney. Thank you! |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2018 22:35:02 GMT
I think you are getting excellent advice here. I have my fireplace going often and have a fall clean and inspection by the chimney sweep. This was the first year he noted some bricks in the firebox needing repair and another thing I can’t remember. He said I could trust it through next winter, then get several estimates & names two resources. So, long story short, find a good chimney person, THEN look for estimates etc. I love having fires to kill the cold damp feel so good luck with this.
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Post by Weed on Apr 7, 2018 22:47:07 GMT
Probably lots of good in-depth videos on the subject @ YouTube. If your damage is what I have pictured in my mind, it should be a quick and very inexpensive project that you could handle yourselves with few tools.
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Post by Bear Foot Farm on Apr 12, 2018 10:42:25 GMT
Sometimes fire departments offer inspection services or might know someone who could do it for you.
It really sounds like it's mostly a cosmetic problem that will be cheap and simple to resolve.
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