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Post by dustawaits on Oct 24, 2019 14:05:11 GMT
Can anyone answer this?
When coyotes are yipping as they run, are they chasing something? Intimidating? Or what?
For the last three nights they have been in my yard. My Collie pup sleeps on the screened in patio, tied so he cannot stray. He barks and they run off then come back. I know that is a tactic to draw a dog away from safety. Last night they were very close to the house running and yipping. He barked as usual but did not go out until they had gone away. I could hear them still yipping further away as they ran.
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caryc
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Post by caryc on Oct 24, 2019 15:58:31 GMT
First, I think it is just a thing they do, like facebook, twitter. Meaning a social conversation.
Secondly, if a yip changes pitch, it tells the rest of the pack, they have struck a trail, rabbits/whitetail/cats, any other nocturnal creatures. And there could be even a different pitch to indicate danger.
It's kind of the same behavior as hunting with dogs either trail dogs, or treeing dogs. Which will yip all the time, and then change pitch when they strike a trail. If trail dogs it lets you know they have stuck a scent, and which way they are going so you can get in front. Treeing dogs, means come on up, here is where I am, and come and kill this thing.
Since coyotes are trail animals, once the "I'm on the scent" is given then the others can fall in, and others will circle to entrap.
Hope that helps.
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caryc
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Post by caryc on Oct 24, 2019 16:00:49 GMT
BTW coyotes won't normally engage a dog, but if they do remember it is a pack mentality and the herd in total will jump the dog. Just a good idea all the way around to keep 'em up.
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Post by feather on Oct 24, 2019 16:40:14 GMT
When a female coyote has a litter and she goes out to find food, the little ones become impatient and they yip a lot waiting there with mom out doing her thing. Usually they give birth to litters in the spring.
Coyote trapping season began here last week-end.
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Post by dustawaits on Oct 24, 2019 17:22:28 GMT
I guess I will have to wait and see what is really going on. The neighbor that put up a game camera should be here next week. I appreciate your comments ...learned something from both of you.
I have never bothered coyotes before but I do have a cat that will stay outside when it warm like last night. I know what they will do to cats and humans for that matter.... Neither dog showed much concern until last night ....the terrier was growling fiercely and the Collie pup was obviously unnerved this morning early when I let him in the house.
Considering the cougar/panther/wildcat that has been hanging around, I am not looking forward to the bear making it’s appearance. Seems like it has gotten awfully wild around here.
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caryc
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Post by caryc on Oct 24, 2019 18:33:54 GMT
I guess I will have to wait and see what is really going on. The neighbor that put up a game camera should be here next week. I appreciate your comments ...learned something from both of you. I have never bothered coyotes before but I do have a cat that will stay outside when it warm like last night. I know what they will do to cats and humans for that matter.... Neither dog showed much concern until last night ....the terrier was growling fiercely and the Collie pup was obviously unnerved this morning early when I let him in the house. Considering the cougar/panther/wildcat that has been hanging around, I am not looking forward to the bear making it’s appearance. Seems like it has gotten awfully wild around here. Just a little FYI, just to be yipping as I run along: Coyotes will take all the cats they can get. As will a wildcat, (meaning bobcat) which is a different species than panther, at least in our AO. I don't know of any attacks on people. That's not to say it hasn't happed, just haven't heard of it. And we have plenty around here. They are classified as a pest animal, and can be put down, at any time, for any reason. We have a fairly large pack that comes through every few weeks, our property is fenced in with 2 x4 welded wire. They will run along the fence, and take any cat found outside of it. I also take my dog for his nightly bladder emptying exercise before bed, I tell him we're going walk about, or check the perimeter. He's road ready. I carry a powerful flashlight and a 9MM. In case we run into any pests, 2, or 4 legged, or ole slithering. We also have neighbors with free ranging dogs, and as far as I know, have never had an encounter. I would think part of the reason for the lack of encounters is usually the time period of people in the woods, and coyotes in the woods is different, with only a small overlay in time early in the AM, or late PM. As with deer. It should also be noted that coyotes are ranging animals. They may have a range, but it is large, meaning they don't stay in one place, like a squirrel or rabbit. So if they came through last night, for instance, tonight if you hear them at all, it will be off aways. They will only stay in an area for a few days, then move on, then come back, maybe like in a month. I was up in a tree stand one evening hunting whitetail, at a spot where they crossed a large creek. Heard a pack get started down river aways, about 30-45 minutes before dark. As I waited I could tell they were coming my way. I was like, Well snot, ain't no deer going to cross now for sure. Not with that pack of coyotes coming my way. Might as well get down and go home. Then another pack got started across the river. Course that ended the deer hunt for sure. As they got to my position you could tell from the barking that they were challenging each other. Getting closer and closer to the crossing, which was a shallow place. I could just see those two packs colliding right under me, and me in the middle. So I gave them the crossing, and listened for any mad coyote to pick up my trail and come my way, but all was good.
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Post by dustawaits on Oct 24, 2019 21:30:51 GMT
One of my friends was chased by coyotes....if they don't bother me I won't bother them. But if ...well I am likely to stop a beating heart. Here they seem to be in a particular area. I used to see them most mornings. But I do not know if this is the same pack...rather think not. Yes cats are fair game and I pray every night my cat stays out that the Lord will take care of him. I think tonight I will make the Collie pup stay indoors. He wants to stay out but what does he know? He is only 8 months old. I do appreciate all you have mentioned ..I no longer walk after dark..the dogs are too tense so I know the panther or something is watching.
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Post by Tim Horton on Oct 25, 2019 5:03:57 GMT
I'm going to say it likely is trying to lure the dog out. I believe pets are pretty much a known food source for coyotes all across North America.
Maybe put the dog somewhere else in the house for a night or two and see what changes.
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Post by dustawaits on Oct 25, 2019 13:36:43 GMT
Tim Horton, exactly what I did. I kept the Collie pup inside last night and all was quiet. Actually this closeness came when he started sleeping on the patio. Usually I do not hear them unless they are near a quarter of a mile away. My Irish Terrier has a wild streak in her and took off for the woods. She came back in fear of her life ..Irish Terriers are fearless.... and though she has run away twice since then she has gone no further than she can see the house. The wolves are one thing the coyotes are another. I do not fear the wolves but I do not trust a coyote.
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Post by christie on Oct 25, 2019 14:30:35 GMT
Coyotes are savvy and highly adaptable creatures. Some live in the city limits of Chicago. Their litter sizes seem to be "in sync" with the food supply. My spouse has even seen one look both ways before crossing the road. We've co-existed with them but have had one that was not afraid of humans. It was dispensed.
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caryc
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Post by caryc on Oct 25, 2019 15:58:07 GMT
One of my friends was chased by coyotes....if they don't bother me I won't bother them. But if ...well I am likely to stop a beating heart. Here they seem to be in a particular area. I used to see them most mornings. But I do not know if this is the same pack...rather think not. Yes cats are fair game and I pray every night my cat stays out that the Lord will take care of him. I think tonight I will make the Collie pup stay indoors. He wants to stay out but what does he know? He is only 8 months old. I do appreciate all you have mentioned ..I no longer walk after dark..the dogs are too tense so I know the panther or something is watching. Like I said, I don't know about all encounters. The coyote was probably thinking, "You are mine to toy with!" Tell him next time: Stop, turn around and face the coyote, take his hat off, and wave it around in front of his face, while sort of crouching over, and waving with his other hand. Works almost every time. LOL Even your own dog doesn't want to have a part/piece of that. No animal wants a piece of a crazy person, not even an Indian. I tell my cats, "You stay on this side of the fence, got it? 'Cuz I can't do nothing to protect you once you cross over." However, you know what they say about curiosity and cats. BTW it's not only coyotes that adapt but nearly all wild game will. Should take that as a note to remember, adapt to the situation. It's just a good rule of thumb to know your AO whether that's country, or city. Being ignorant can get you killed in either one. It should also be noted that nearly all wild animals have their young in the spring. At least I can't think of any, at the moment, that don't. Domestic's are different. Hope that helps, O and BTW I wouldn't test out the hat thing on a wild critter, unless I was either a fast runner or good climber. LOL Also: let me know if you hear any over the next few days, would love to know if the pattern holds.
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Post by Tim Horton on Oct 26, 2019 4:23:45 GMT
The wolves are one thing the coyotes are another. I do not fear the wolves but I do not trust a coyote.
>>>>>> In this part of the north, the rule is don't trust either....
Remember.... The farther north you go, the more things that can and want to eat you and your horse. Grandpa Gilbert
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Post by dustawaits on Oct 26, 2019 13:41:36 GMT
Unfortunately for the wolves... they were human raised and turned loose here by the DNR. They have not adapted and I honestly do not know how they are surviving. They do not kill calves ...if they did they would wipe out the farmers. Maybe they survive on carrion . The timber wolves are pathetically thin. The red wolves again human raised and turned out with the timber wolves as young pups, look some better but maybe raiding garbage. So CWD is transmitted to the eater. I hope that is not what is wrong with the wolves. I don’t think the deer have CWD close here but the game wardens are killing ever deer they see.
Tim, the wolves in your area are born wild they have no respect for humans.
Also though I have not seen coydogs here, where I lived previously they were numerous and dangerous. They usually traveled in large packs. The farmers got together one year sick of the damage and death and wiped out 16 one morning. They had no respect for humans or life..their object was to kill or maim. They also ran as often or more so in the daytime as night.
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caryc
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Post by caryc on Oct 26, 2019 15:31:05 GMT
Unfortunately for the wolves... they were human raised and turned loose here by the DNR. They have not adapted and I honestly do not know how they are surviving. They do not kill calves ...if they did they would wipe out the farmers. Maybe they survive on carrion . The timber wolves are pathetically thin. The red wolves again human raised and turned out with the timber wolves as young pups, look some better but maybe raiding garbage. So CWD is transmitted to the eater. I hope that is not what is wrong with the wolves. I don’t think the deer have CWD close here but the game wardens are killing ever deer they see. Tim, the wolves in your area are born wild they have no respect for humans. Also though I have not seen coydogs here, where I lived previously they were numerous and dangerous. They usually traveled in large packs. The farmers got together one year sick of the damage and death and wiped out 16 one morning. They had no respect for humans or life..their object was to kill or maim. They also ran as often or more so in the daytime as night. Hummmm I can tell where Tim is from, big Canada flag is a dead giveaway, unless he's trying to fake me out - it worked. And am not asking where you are from, it's fine. But comparing your area with mine, I don't understand why the game wardens are killing every deer they see. We have CWD sort of semi close, and they aren't doing that here. Yes, we do have a lot of road kill deer (roughly 3000 a year)that the wardens pick up and test, and any that appear to be infected, thin stumbling around, look drunk, etc, they may put down, and they are asking the hunters to have all their deer tested and have set up testing sites all over the state. But not just putting them down for no reason. Odd to say the least. Never heard of coydogs. That's not to say it doesn't happen, just I never heard of it. Two different species, like dogs and cats. but hey I guess it's possible. However we do have wild packs of dogs here, that do travel/range/hunt in the daytime. Found this, just for info purposes: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coydog
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Post by dustawaits on Oct 26, 2019 15:45:59 GMT
I guarantee there are coydogs and they are deeply hated. Many female dogs of different breeds run loose, been turned out of kennels,etc. Maybe the coyotes in some areas are just less particular of their females. I am talking about SW Missouri. Many farmers now have LGDs running with their cattle to protect them. But they are in Arkansas too.
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Post by feather on Oct 26, 2019 16:56:39 GMT
dustawaits, I just wanted to say, that I would be afraid of wolves. They travel in packs and when DH and his son were trapping, they were stalked by a pack of wolves and it was dangerous. Here's a picture of a bobcat caught in a coyote trap, it was released, here in Wisconsin. What a beautiful animal. And bobcats are in most of the US.
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Post by dustawaits on Oct 26, 2019 18:42:54 GMT
feather, the wolves of the north were always considered to be dangerous, wisely so! But the wolves here were human raised and I am guessing had too much contact with them. They raise a litter every year or two within about 300 < >ft of my house. Reason I know as much as I do about them. The red ones have crossed my yard within 50 ft of the house. They are at home here. One of the timber wolves got within 10 ft of me ( reason I know the size!) I said Go and it went without fear . The big cats are beautiful and it is sad to see them in traps. There is such a size difference in bob cats. One mated with our two female cats. We promptly had them spayed. He came back 9 weeks later and killed every kitten in the neighborhood and some of the females as well. He did not survive his killing spree. I was driving a backroad and there was one sauntering across the road. I had to stop to allow him to get out of my way. They were very arrogant. I have heard there is one around here but have not seen it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2019 15:41:31 GMT
When the coyotes start up, my LGDs go out barking. They stay within their self-chosen parameters (not necessarily the fence, LOL), and the coyotes take off once they hear my motley crew vocalizing. Sometimes, the inside dogs get into the act, and we have 6 big dogs barking their heads off.
I think the dogs are saying, "You dang skate punk kids, keep the heck off of my lawn!"
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Post by Tim Horton on Oct 28, 2019 18:43:59 GMT
Coyotes........ Coyotes are bad enough in there own way in many places more so than others. That is one thing. An apples and oranges thing to a point compared to other issues.
The other thing is re introducing the wolf to some of the places it has been done is the biggest mistake that could be made. Too many times this is pushed by people believing things like "wild places need wild animals" The fact being 99% of these people will not have to live with the consequences of this action. My pet peeve and opinion.
Because they look a lot alike, and a lot like Fido many people think the wolf and coyote will predictably act alike... To a small point yes, but not so in many many ways.
For instance.. I have read some of the follow up reports of re introducing the grew wolf to upper Wisconsin under Lake Superior. To include the numbers re introduced, the ultimate result of them reproducing to a population 400% or more bigger numbers than predicted in the given time. How there range has increased deep into the central state. Yes people have been quite shocked to see them running through corn and bean fields. How they have impacted the elk herd imported to the upper area requiring 2 or 3 more herd to be imported to try to produce a stable population of elk. How they have impacted deer populations. How they have impacted livestock... Pet losses, and you name it.
We have much the same here. The wolf has decimated the woodland caribou to a dangerous low level. The feel good legislation to stop grizzly hunting has led to a sky rocket of livestock and human incidents. Again people with nothing more than emotion and using emotion to over ride science. People who do not suffer the consequences of there actions.
Again my 5 cents of opinion, knowledge, and pet peeve.
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Post by feather on Oct 28, 2019 18:52:17 GMT
Tim Horton, I agree with you 100%. It's amazing how many people get mad about deer hunting bambi and trapping...even when they will otherwise die of disease from over population and getting hit by cars. Crop damage is obviously a problem too. We used to vacation just south of lake superior in Wisconsin. It was an exceptionally dark night, out in the middle of no cities, and the wolves were howling. I didn't go for my walk, it freaked me out too much. We saw a coyote and wolf while traveling the upper penn of michigan. We saw bear right where we were staying, at the burning barrel. Made for some interesting memories from our little kids at the time.
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Post by Tim Horton on Oct 28, 2019 22:08:41 GMT
We saw a coyote and wolf while traveling the upper penn of michigan. We saw bear right where we were staying, at the burning barrel. Made for some interesting memories from our little kids at the time.
>>>>>>>>>>> Us also... Even living everyday here in the bush we get excited seeing all manor of wildlife. Seeing something cross the pasture, cross the road, the geese and loons on our pond. Seeing the moose in the edge of town browsing on shrubs in someones yard. The otters roll and tumble on the warm pavement on there way from one pond to another. Bob the cross eyed beaver who lives on the swamp below us across the road. Who lately has started falling trees onto the road. On the edge of town picking apples in someones yard and notice the bears watching us from a discreet distance.
However... You always keep in mind, they keep there distance, I will keep mine. Predators that cross my comfort boundaries around livestock is a whole different issue....
Another pet peeve is people from the city usually go from there manicured yards, parks etc to there manicured resort, and if they don't see something with big horns and something with big teeth, they consider there trip a failure. And these people vote. Whether they know anything about an issue or not........
Don't get me started....
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Post by dustawaits on Oct 28, 2019 22:11:45 GMT
Ever hear of making a Jurassic Park? This area south..... the wild animals are encouraged. They are brought in...people won’t leave? Poisonous snakes in populated areas. Flooding? You are not allowed to return.... People have no sense, no such thing as wildcats. No such thing as bears, wolves...you shoot a wolf...$5000 fine, radio collars/ ear tags on them. You kill a panther you have to skin it and give them the skin.....
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Post by mogal on Oct 29, 2019 1:30:14 GMT
DH and I had to go into town just after sun up this morning. Saw 3 does and a nice big buck before we'd gone 3 miles and several dead deer along the roads as well as raccoons, oppossums and a couple of armadillos.
DH and I had to go back almost to town about 3 this afternoon. Saw a coyote in an open harvested field about a mile west of us and 4 deer.
We also have cougars and bears in the area all from reintroductions or migrating here from reintroductions in another state (gee thanks, Arkansas). I no longer walk outside our 3 acre fenced yard that's protected by 2 Great Pyrenees. I will drive the truck or even the tractor out to the pastures. I hope the tractor which is open, no cab, is big enough and loud enough to keep said beasties away. A gun is a wonderful thing assuming you have time to use it.
I had a deer run into the side of my truck years ago. She actually tried to jump the hood of the truck and missed. She bounced along the entire left side (driver's) of the truck, folded the side view mirror back which exploded the side window into the cab. Then her feet went through the front edge of the topper that extended outside the cab, just behind my head. Damage to the truck exterior was over $1K in 1986 dollars. I was driving alone, thank goodness, because I am sure any passenger would have been lacerated by all the flying glass. I had glass in my hair, down my shirt, in the arm rest on the right door, down in the heat/AC vents and it blew out every time we turned on the heat for quite a while. The point I'm about to make is that this was a little doe, probably that spring's fawn weighed maybe 80#. Missouri has reintroduced elk into southern MO and I dread the first reports of a collision between an elk and a vehicle. I was wearing glasses with tempered lenses in them and each lens had a deep gouge in it. I consider myself blessed that the worst I had was 3 small scratches on the left side of my face that closed within a couple of days.
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Post by mogal on Oct 29, 2019 11:11:10 GMT
Ever hear of making a Jurassic Park? The line I always loved in the first Jurassic Park movie was said by Laura Dern's character about we can do it but should we do it. Don't remember the specific words but she referred to the wisdom of recreating an extinct ecosystem in a modern world. DH and I took a vacation out to Wyoming in '95, the year of or just prior to the restocking of wolves in Yellowstone. Talk about polarization! Holy cow! You were either for or "agin" it and there was no middle ground. Yes, it would be nice to have a species that was original to the area but as a producer of cattle, sheep, goats and horses over the years, I also knew that the wolves wouldn't stay within the manmade boundary of their domain and limit themselves only to indigenous local prey.
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