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Post by feather on Jun 13, 2020 17:02:46 GMT
I do have two small whetstones, too small and not elevated, which makes it possible to sharpen my knives but not comfortable for sharpening. It is a struggle due to the small surface area and lack of elevation.
If you were to purchase a whetstone for sharpening knives for the kitchen, what is the optimal size of it? Any particular brands or types you've used and are satisfied with?
What grit levels do you suggest? I have the patience but not the right tool.
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Post by Skandi on Jun 13, 2020 18:41:18 GMT
I have two one is about 2x7x1 and the other is much smaller at 1x0.5x6 I use them differently the large one sits on the kitchen counter and the knife moves over it, the smaller one I move and the blade stays still. I tend to use that one for things like scissors or blades with a bend in them.
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Post by feather on Jun 13, 2020 23:55:26 GMT
Skandi, thanks so much. I am seeing most of the whetstones are 7 inches by 2.3 inches. I never thought of using the small ones moving them along the blade, good idea. Here are my choices for grits, most of the whetstones are one grit on one side and another grit on the other side. 400/1000 1000/4000 1000/6000 3000/8000 8000 and above are considered polishing 8000/12000 There is a fellow that sells maple syrup and if I remember right he also sharpens knives and scissors for his business. I wonder if he'll wander by and give some advice for the home knife user in need of advice? This is a skill I need to get good at and why not with all the knives I use daily for all the chopping and prepping food I do. I'll know if I'm doing okay depending on how well I sharpen my 20 knives (and maybe someday scissors). Mr feather will not sharpen knives even though he has 10-15 knives of his own, for trapping season, so if he needs to have them sharpened he can hire me instead of a stranger. It also doesn't look like rocket science to sharpen a lawn mower blade. Different tools but same concept. When I went out to north dakota to visit my son and roommate, they both asked if one of us could sharpen their knives, which kind of surprised me. If I can get some confidence in doing this, then I'll sharpen their knives next time I visit them.
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Post by feather on Jun 14, 2020 1:17:49 GMT
Tallpines, I loved hearing that story. Grandmas are brilliant.
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Post by Cabin Fever on Jun 14, 2020 15:28:14 GMT
I sharpen all of our knives, whether they are kitchen knife, pocket knife, or hunting knife with a simple sharpening device like the one below. Once side is carbide and the other ceramic. The knives come out razor sharp with just a few swipes through the device. You can find really fancy ones made for Williams-Sonoma or Wusthof for $40 to over $100. If your knifes are super dull this might not work you.
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Post by feather on Jun 14, 2020 15:34:41 GMT
Cabin Fever, nice. It has a course and a fine setting top and bottom. I do have this little device, not course to fine, just one swipe through, or 20 swipes through each side and it helps but not enough. Do you remember the maple syrup guy that also sharpens things? I thought his name was Max maybe?
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Post by feather on Jun 14, 2020 15:43:31 GMT
Tallpines , I loved hearing that story. Grandmas are brilliant. Yup .... those Granma’s! They knew how to “get-er-done” and “keep-er-movin” ..... 😁 Due to you cluing me in on the charlie berens videos, we have seen them all now. That is a feat in itself. 99% of them he tries not to swear, or bleeps it out, which I find endearing. There were two though, that used profanity or at least were not politically correct. One was called 'I sh**t you not', about hunting with his family, the family van, that one is terrifically funny. The other was one with ISIS in the title, where he is on a board of directors brainstorming good ideas, that one is so funny I cried, and then we watched it again. Try not to miss the printed screen for SVU special dipshit unit or something similar. Time to get some work done and figure out what grits of whetstone I need. Keep'er movin'.
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Post by Cabin Fever on Jun 14, 2020 19:53:57 GMT
Cabin Fever , nice. It has a course and a fine setting top and bottom. I do have this little device, not course to fine, just one swipe through, or 20 swipes through each side and it helps but not enough. Do you remember the maple syrup guy that also sharpens things? I thought his name was Max maybe? Yes, his name is Max. I'll PM you with some specific information.
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Post by feather on Jun 14, 2020 20:19:21 GMT
Cabin Fever, I found him and emailed him and he wrote back. He said unless the electricity goes out, he probably wouldn't use whetstones but suggested the 400/1000 and 3000/8000. He said he would suggest using "a verticle 1" x 42" belt sander with 150 grit red aluminum oxide belt, then I used a fiber deburring wheel, then a cotton wheel with red jewlers rouge. I can sharpen a kitchen knife in just a few seconds" He is a professional tool sharpener, so he knows.
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Post by Cabin Fever on Jun 14, 2020 20:38:25 GMT
Cabin Fever , I found him and emailed him and he wrote back. He said unless the electricity goes out, he probably wouldn't use whetstones but suggested the 400/1000 and 3000/8000. He said he would suggest using "a verticle 1" x 42" belt sander with 150 grit red aluminum oxide belt, then I used a fiber deburring wheel, then a cotton wheel with red jewlers rouge. I can sharpen a kitchen knife in just a few seconds" He is a professional tool sharpener, so he knows. He should know. His explanation reminds me of when I had a fish fillet knife professionally sharpened at a outdoor sports show. We use a bench grinder with a sand paper disc on one side and a paper buffing wheel (with red rouge) on the other. The paper wheels were like the set below. Here is a youtube that shows the process:
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Post by feather on Jun 14, 2020 21:05:12 GMT
Cabin Fever, cool video and I liked how quiet it was, except for the screaming blood and bandage. I know this won't appeal to the 'gotta have my power tools gang', but there is something calming and enjoyable about sharpening with a whetstone, even if it takes much longer. It's like darning a sock, or hemming a dress. Trying to get the technique right, make good habits and end up with a sharp knife.
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Post by feather on Jun 18, 2020 1:55:00 GMT
My big chef knife is now sharp! We tested it on a tomato, slick slick slick. Usually that knife is more of a brute force chop, now it slides easily through the skin of a tomato. Very out of character for that knife.
I was going to work on my paring knife but mr feather commandeered my whetstones for 4 blades on a couple jack knives. More sharpening tomorrow.
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Post by feather on Jun 18, 2020 17:00:18 GMT
Each time I sharpen a knife, I go watch another video on sharpening with whetstones and learn something new. I find the whole experience very therapeutic, calming, mindful, and zen. I am one with the whetstones and knife. The angle is critical, 10-20 (or 23 degrees), with sushi knives at an angle of 10 degrees. I'm comfortable at 15%, easier to do on large knives, harder to keep that angle on small knives. The stones are soaked, information varies, for 10 minutes, for 24 hours. The stone's flatness is maintained by cleaning it with a scouring stone after each sharpening. The sushi chef said he is using all parts of the stone equally, this way no one part of the stone becomes more indented than any other part of the stone. So it is not just the knife edge, but the stone can be maintained with good habits. The 400 grit stone is the stone to create the cutting edge. On one of my small cheap knives, it had no actual cutting edge, it was like a piece of thin metal stuck into a blade. To put an edge on it, it takes me about 1/2 an hour on a knife with no good cutting edge. Most of the rest of the larger knives have an edge that can be refined to a sharp edge. The 1000 grit stone continues to take off burrs and unevenness on the cutting edge, consistency in the angle of the blade is important. The 3000 makes the edge really nice and sharp, and the 8000 grit polishes the edge smooth and shiny. It takes me 20 to 40 minutes per knife. I'm sure I'll get better with more practice, better as in more consistent, not better with shorter time. I have 4 knives done and I plan on doing 2 more today. Feather having fun with kitchen weapons.
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Post by Skandi on Jun 18, 2020 22:13:10 GMT
How long it takes also really depends on the knife and how it is tempered. hubbies kitchen knife set is a much harder steel than mine, so his takes an age to sharpen but holds the edge, mine are softer so are fast to sharpen but lose it very quickly, my belt knife is mild steel of some sort and takes a wicked edge but again loses it pretty fast.
generally in the kitchen I use a steel to sharpen it's a lot less hassle than a stone, but short knives I find are difficult on a steel so back to the stone for them.
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Post by feather on Jun 19, 2020 0:19:19 GMT
Thanks Skandi, I was reading that carbon steel takes an edge more easily (than stainless steel) and keeps the edge longer (than stainless steel). Most of my knives are stainless steel but it looks like one of mr feathers jackknives blades are carbon steel, I can't be sure but they have that patina to them. I'm not sure. I had to use a totally different pattern of sharpening for my short knives, like the jack knives (with a mind to using all parts of the whetstone as evenly as possible.) Holding the knife in my right hand, and pressing two fingers on the blade against the whetstone. In both directions, away from the blade and towards the blade, also in a zig zag forward and back repeatedly and small, doing the tips and curves separately, then blending the straight parts to the curve and tips in one motion, usually across the 2 inches of whetstone instead of lengthwise. After I get more practice with this, I plan on buying some better knives but no use buying better knives until I'm good at this. A friend of mine said the mundial knives from Brazil were more affordable (than say the German or Japanese knives). I saw that some of the mundial knives were forged (instead of stamped) and carbon steel (instead of just stainless steel), and those are both positives. Sometimes with forged knives they put the carbon steel inside the the stainless steel, so the cutting edge is carbon steel but the stainless steel gives structure and stability to the knife. The japanese knives are thinner and need to be sharpened at 10-15 degress while the german knives are heavier and need to be sharpened at 20 degrees, so far I have neither, worry about it not! I realized I had a mundial knife but only a food service knife without all those great features, a paring knife. My hands got tired sharpening today. Mr feather cut himself last night using my whetstones. I checked his jackknives and they were still pretty dull, so I cleaned them up and sharpened them all, well, at least the ones from the garage and his pocket. He has quite a collection he uses. I know it won't be long before I slip and cut myself as well, it's just a game of odds and I'm being very careful. I resurfaced all the whetstones and washed them down, washed all the grit and metal off the kitchen bread board where I work. I have a thick woven placemat that I use under the whetstones for stability and to soak up the water. I washed that out too and hung it to dry. To start again tomorrow. I'm loving it. I have an odd knife I want to sharpen. It's an ulu with a bone handle. One side is tapered into the cutting edge while the back is not at all. The back has quite a few nicks in it, or burrs but no cutting edge. I'm not sure how to sharpen it. My knives have been so neglected until now. I would guess I just smooth the burrs and nicks, then sharpen the tapered cutting edge. If anyone knows, let me know.
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Post by feather on Jun 19, 2020 1:20:49 GMT
Woo Hoo, guess what I learned. That jackknife I thought could be carbon steel IS carbon steel. It's called a Schrade Old Timer, and it was quite discolored not like stainless steel. It has 3 blades. I improved the looks and the knives sharpness. So I looked it up here: knife-depot.com/pages/the-ultimate-guide-to-old-timer-knivesAnd found this: It's one of his tried and true jackknives, quite old. It had quite a bit of discoloration I cleaned up with steel wool before I began sharpening and it took a good edge. That was fun. Now I know I've done 3 blades in carbon steel.
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Post by Cabin Fever on Jun 19, 2020 12:53:35 GMT
My brother gift each member of his wedding party with an Old Timer jackknife. That was in 1977. I still have mine.
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Post by feather on Jun 19, 2020 12:59:04 GMT
My brother gift each member of his wedding party with an Old Timer jackknife. That was in 1977. I still have mine. Well see then, it probably has a carbon steel blade or 2 or 3 or 4. Last night Mr feather and I were looking through some of his jack knife collection. There were 5 Old Timers, different models. It's a good idea to keep them dry, always, and a light coat of mineral oil occasionally will keep the finish on the blades.
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Post by Cabin Fever on Jun 19, 2020 13:37:39 GMT
My brother gift each member of his wedding party with an Old Timer jackknife. That was in 1977. I still have mine. Well see then, it probably has a carbon steel blade or 2 or 3 or 4. Last night Mr feather and I were looking through some of his jack knife collection. There were 5 Old Timers, different models. It's a good idea to keep them dry, always, and a light coat of mineral oil occasionally will keep the finish on the blades. Good idea. The 3 blades on my OT are very tarnished and blackened. I should clean and oil it.
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Post by feather on Jun 19, 2020 13:47:18 GMT
Cabin Fever , I used some steel wool to clean the blades, they didn't completely go back to shiny, but much better.
Oooohhhhh Ahhhhhhhh, check out this whittler's knife, perfect for young adults and old adults alike, for working on twigs and branches out camping. Carbon steel and an Old Timer to boot.
Old Timer 24OT Splinter Carvin' 6in Traditional Folding Whittling Knife with 1.5in Detail Blade and Sawcut Handle for Outdoor, Hunting, Camping and EDC On sale for $13.91 on amazon, would make a nice christmas stocking stuffer.
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Post by Cabin Fever on Jun 19, 2020 14:59:20 GMT
Nice looking knife. I read that the US company that made Old Timer knives was sold in 2004. They are now made in China. Bummer.
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Post by feather on Jun 19, 2020 15:15:57 GMT
Nice looking knife. I read that the US company that made Old Timer knives was sold in 2004. They are now made in China. Bummer. I read that too. It is a bummer.
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Post by feather on Jun 21, 2020 2:14:41 GMT
I think I put in a couple hours today on knives on the whetstones. I like doing it when something is in the microwave or I'm waiting for something to get done on the stove and I take breaks just to put in 20 minutes on the whetstones.
I resharpened the biggest clunkiest chef knife. I didn't think the edge was really that good so I started on it again, gave the edge a better form and worked my way through all 4 grits.
I was able to sharpen the stainless ulu knife. Even though one side is not tapered, it is just flat, I sharpened that side as though it would have a knife shape, but very narrow on the edge. The tapered blade formed side I sharpened at about 20 degrees. Now it's razor sharp and the knife drawer is a more dangerous place to put your hands.
Mr feather has a trapping knife, like a fillet knife, thin that's been sharpened so often by machine, half the metal is gone. It's still a good knife so I worked on that this afternoon and evening and it's in good shape now.
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Post by feather on Jun 23, 2020 20:34:25 GMT
What a fun adventure the knife sharpening has been. We both decided to buy a new knife, him to have a knife where half the metal hasn't been sharpened away and me to get a new paring knife since 2 of mine are missing rivets and are ready to fall apart. On his collection of trapping knives, he brought me the 4 worst. The first worst was like looking at the rocky mountains, it hadn't been sharpened by a knife sharpener by machine or by hand in years. He had used a hand sharpener that runs across the knife but would probably be best for a knife that had a level surface and not the rocky mountains. It was sorrowful. I held it at a 20 degree angle on the breadboard, and like Skandi said and also on youtube sharpening videos said, run the whetstone across the blade instead of the other way around. I push and pull the whetstone parallel to the breadboard. This takes off the hills. While it is not perfect now, it sure looks a lot better and the edge is great. His first trapping knife I did, is razor sharp and it does tomatoes like a champ. It's a pleasure to have sharp knives again in the kitchen. yeah, I'm not giving it back to him, it's mine now, for tomatoes in the kitchen. We decided to get all his trapping knives sharpened, by me. Since I've been found to do a pretty good job. (even I'm impressed) And he needs a knife holder, to roll up. Something along the lines of this, made of jean material. Since his collection of trapping knives approaches 20, 2 knife holders. He does the cutting in the garage so the holder has to be up on the wall, so two knife holders, I'll make them out of jeans. They will have the blades up. Then as he uses them and they dull, he can bring them in the kitchen for sharpening and then they go back in the holders. The holders will be tacked to the wall so I'll attach some straps to them, and he can tack them onto the 2x4's. Like this:
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