She's huffing and puffing :(

[Deleted]

I recall reading Pony's harrowing story of her goat being down for the last portion of her pregnancy and I thought about my big doe who was, at the time, beginning to get slower and less interested in walking around.

Now she's due any time and though she CAN get up, she no longer wants to and her breathing sounds like such a struggle when laying down that I'm starting to worry. She's in a pen to get some peace and quiet and I've put hay and water right where she can get it, but when she eats she raises up on her knuckles to give herself some room to breathe as she chews. I so want her to just get to it and have the kids so she can breathe easy again, but nothing happening on the business end yet.

[grannyg]

when our old goat went into labor, she would paw the ground and make groaning noises....but she got the job done eventually

[Deleted]

Is her color good? How are her ligaments?

When my gals are heavy bred, I will dose them with CMPK or Magic, just to be on the safe side. Won't hurt, and could give her a bit of a boost as she heads into the home stretch.

[Deleted]

Ug, no, she's pale. I've given her vitamin b and some iron. she can't eat much. It seems to put a lot of pressure on her lungs and she has to quit. I'm afraid she'll go into ketosis.

[Deleted]

Sorry, missed the ligament question. When she was up more it looked like the ligaments had gotten quite soft. I have a hard time feeling them. Now that she's down, it's a lot harder to see.

[Deleted]

Yeah, it's milk fever. There was no CMPK to be found within 100 miles and I got the very last bottle of calcium gluconate then some iron, magnesium and potassium in oral doses. Couldn't find a consensus on dosing and injection site so I went with instructions I found to do it in several sites over the shoulder and ribs. Called the vet for an opinion and he recommended that if she needed more to give one shot to the perineum. Good grief, that sounds painful. Never heard of giving a shot there. Has anyone else?

[Deleted]

Here's a recipe for "Magic" which will work great as an oral drench:

1 part Corn Oil (do not substitute with canola or vegetable oil)
1 part Molasses
1 part Corn Syrup

You can add some cayenne pepper to this as well, which is often helpful for just about anything.

When is the last time you wormed?

[Bear Foot Farm]

Called the vet for an opinion and he recommended that if she needed more to give one shot to the perineum. Good grief, that sounds painful. Never heard of giving a shot there. Has anyone else?

I've done it, and it doesn't seem to bother them more than anything else we do to them
Good luck

[Deleted]

Thanks, Pony, I'll try that. I did give her some molasses when she couldn't eat her grain. I use herbal wormer weekly. It's always worked, however I ran out and ended up skipping two weeks in a row at the end of March. I'm going to send a sample out to get that checked. She's never had any odd poops or anything and was looking pretty pink until all this started.

[Deleted]

Apr 3, 2015 18:14:14 GMT Bear Foot Farm said:

Called the vet for an opinion and he recommended that if she needed more to give one shot to the perineum. Good grief, that sounds painful. Never heard of giving a shot there. Has anyone else?

I've done it, and it doesn't seem to bother them more than anything else we do to them
Good luck

Thanks, Bearfoot. Might be trying that if she needs another dose. Makes me a bit nervous but hopefully all goes well.

[Deleted]

How's she doing? I've been thinking about her (well, you, too!) but been kind of busy this evening.

[Deleted]

Thanks for your thoughts, Pony

Her breathing is less labored but she still isn't keen on getting up or eating a lot at one time. She had some discharge starting earlier today. I gave her some more calcium tonight. Did it in the perineum (wasn't as terrifying as I feared). I hope she has those kids soon.

[Deleted]

Hows the nanny this morning? Hope she kidded over night and everything aok.

[Deleted]

What day is she now, Woolie? You may want to go ahead and induce her if she's past 145.

[Deleted]

Worst day ever. She started pushing early this morning, a water sack was out. Watched and waited a bit but she seemed so weak so we called the vet. Vet said to wait. Only one available was emergency vet.

Watched, waited. Finally went in to check and when I did she really started pushing but I could feel that it was breach. Was able to pull out one, huge dead buck kid. A small weak, but alive doe came next. Tried to get her to a teat. No milk.

Another kid was coming. This one with a leg folded back. Vet's on the phone. She's coming now. I got the third kid out. Also dead. Another one is still way up there. The neighbour lady comes to help and reaches up to pull the fourth kid. Also dead. The mother is exhausted so bad she looked like she was about to die herself. @0 minutes later, the vet shows up, examines her and tells me she thinks she's got CAE. Wow. This could not be worse.

The living baby will not take anything I've tried to give her and she's very, very weak. I wish I could say I feel some hope left but I've just run out.

While all this is going on, a friend who took our car out to get some supplies we badly needed got pulled over fr speeding and accused of having drugs because of some perfume she was wearing. The car was impounded. No drugs found, no files charged but now we have a huge vet bill and a fee to get the car out of impound. Don't even get me started on law enforcement these days. Nice to get kicked when you're down.

Don't know what else to try with the baby. I'm just having a real sad day. I just have one prayer left in me for now, and that's that God will make tomorrow a better day than today.

[Deleted]

Oh, woolieface, that's awful.

[mzgarden]

I am so sorry.

[Deleted]

You need to get some colostrum out and tube the kid, if it will not suck !!! If you don't it won't make it !! Sorry you are having troubles, how is the doe doing ? Why did the vet think she has CAE ? You need to get some clean colostrum if she does, or you will pass it on.

[Deleted]

We did have clean colostrum frozen so we gave her that but she faded so quickly, inspite of finally taking a little bit. Lost her too. She was so tiny and fragile. The other three were Enormous.

The vet said that her udder was hard, but she didn't have mastitis. Said that and her other "symptoms" were why she suspected CAE. I was pretty beside myself at this point in the day and wasn't thinking to ask which symptoms she meant. Not sure how long the test will take. This goat has always been very healthy seeming. No symptoms of trouble walking or stiffness or anything I could have ever suspected was CAE. It sucks because I kept her baby from last year and she now also has a kid and they both stayed with their mother.

Is anything sadder than a grieving mother goat? Wish there was something more I could do to help her.

[Deleted]

Sorry for your loss. I would test the doe in a couple week or so. She could just have a congested udder. Are her knees swollen also ?

[Deleted]

Apr 5, 2015 13:44:05 GMT @coso said:

Sorry for your loss. I would test the doe in a couple week or so. She could just have a congested udder. Are her knees swollen also ?

The vet went ahead and took the sample for the test while she was here, so we're just waiting for the results now. If she's positive, i'll have to have the rest of them tested. No swelling in the knees. Never had any trouble at all. When I'd bring them in at night from the back, she'd be the first one bounding, springing and kicking all the way down the hill. The last week is the only time I've seen that goat act ill. I feel sceptical of the vet's diagnosis, but we'll see.

[Deleted]

Only way to know is to test. They can be asymptomatic for a long time !! At least you will know !!

[Deleted]

Oh, Woolieface! I am so very very very sorry! What a horrible day!

I, too, would be sceptical of the vet's dx. We'll see, but if she comes back with a low positive, I'd send in a fresh sample in a couple of weeks. The enormous stress she just went through can certainly cause a false positive.

{HUGS} My heart hurts for you. The goat and then the stooooopid cops impounding your car for no valid reason. Augh!

[Deleted]

Thanks Pony, I needed the hugs.

Another doe also with mutant, giant kids tried to deliver today and lost both. That's it for our kidding season. One live kid from a third doe. We've been really beat down the last couple of days. I felt up there and found a kid in a rolled position with the top of its back facing me. Found legs that didn't belong to that one and called the vet but it was all she could do to get them out to save the doe's life. Had to use a chain to yank them. Twin bucks. Huge things. I'm really perplexed. We bred an Alpine buck (a rather small one) to an Alpine doe and Nubian/Alpine cross doe. It doesn't even make sense to me that he threw kids that big. I didn't weigh them but I know 30 lbs when I pick it up and just those two weighed at least that.

The cop thing, when I heard the details got worse. She was tazed and thrown to the ground over the "open container" of soda in the drink holder. Now we have to try to get some kind of justice but if we do, I'll be thanking God and not the court system.

I just hope the sheep go a lot better.

[Deleted]

Holy smokes, Woolieface!

That cop... was there a videocam going? God help you, but most of all, God give that cop the lesson he needs - and deserves!

Praying that your sheep do MUCH better than the goats... {more Pony hugs}

[mzgarden]

I just don't have any words for what you've been through. <hugs> to you, what an awful time.

Perhaps when the pain has receded and you begin to consider what may have caused this disaster, you'll be able to share  your perspective.

As first time goat people, with our first time kidding planned for next year, this terrifies me.  I can't imagine the sadness.

[manygoatsnmore]

I'm sorry, woolieface...what an awful week.

[Deleted]

Apr 8, 2015 1:19:30 GMT @pony said:

Holy smokes, Woolieface!

That cop... was there a videocam going? God help you, but most of all, God give that cop the lesson he needs - and deserves!

Praying that your sheep do MUCH better than the goats... {more Pony hugs}

We don't know if there was a dash cam. She assumed so because they had nice, newer patrol cars with bells and whistles. I hope, though I don't know, that we can demand it as evidence if there is one.

[Deleted]

Apr 8, 2015 13:42:52 GMT mzgarden said:

I just don't have any words for what you've been through. <hugs> to you, what an awful time.

Perhaps when the pain has receded and you begin to consider what may have caused this disaster, you'll be able to share  your perspective.

As first time goat people, with our first time kidding planned for next year, this terrifies me.  I can't imagine the sadness.

Don't let my bad season terrify you. I really don't know what happened here, but I can only assume it's rare. Our buck should have had same size genetics as the does and somehow he threw Bizarrely massive offspring. Needless to say, we will not use him again. It was really heart wrenching, the whole thing. The last doe is still trying to recover from it all and is pretty weak still. All the kids were just beautiful. We would have loved to have had them.

[Deleted]

Apr 8, 2015 13:51:54 GMT @redfish said:

Not that it helps now, but how are you feeding your girls? That might have more to do with the size than the buck. At least it would be something that you could try and fix for next year. Hugs and prayers!