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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2016 18:39:44 GMT
Do we have a section for these topics? I'm very interested in learning more and sharing ideas as this is the direction I'm moving? Thanks
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Post by jd4020 on Mar 29, 2016 18:53:47 GMT
I don't know if you are interested, but I have been watching Off grid with Doug and Stacy, and Fouch-o-matic off grid, youtubes. Esther, on Fouch-o-matic is Carla Emorys' daughter. I'm sure there are others.  |
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Post by LauraD on Apr 5, 2016 2:00:31 GMT
We're going to go this way, so a forum on it would be nice...
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Post by spacecase0 on Apr 5, 2016 6:42:06 GMT
I am off grid for my lighting and some other things (like radio and power tools),
can help any one set that up if people want
I only look at recent threads, so I really don't care what category it is in
but there should be a place for it all
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Post by wally on Apr 5, 2016 21:12:04 GMT
I am interested in solar. I have read several books about solar power but my brain just goes dead when thinking about it
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Post by spacecase0 on Apr 5, 2016 22:42:13 GMT
there are 2 types of electric solar people put in,
off grid, and
grid tied
if you are reading info on grid tied and you want off grid, it is not going to make much sense
most people that put in grid tie solar just hire a contractor to do it, and it is purely to save money on your power bill
off grid solar use to be popular, but is not so much anymore
off grid can be pretty simple, or annoyingly complex,
the simplest version is what I have,
a solar panel, charge controller, batteries, lights, and some wire to connect things.
everything is set up for 12VDC, just like most cars run on, this makes it easy to get things to work with it,
for example, I can take the old battery from my car that will not start the car anymore, but it will still run small lights just fine...
now the usual problem is that most things people have run on 120VAC, and AC power can't be made direct from a battery, so you need a converter. (usually called an inverter)
the other problem with that is that most things that just plug into the wall (120VAC) are horribly inefficient, so then you need the converter and large batteries and solar, and the power involved does not work so well with 12V converters...
so now you might need a 24V or 48V or something for the solar, charge controller, batteries, and not so common converter to make your 120V AC
there is also lots of things with the solar on how to calculate your load and how big the batteries and solar have to be...
if you start small, you can run a few lights pretty easy without all that messy math, and it will give you a great idea how to start connecting everything else to it.
if you think about it, lighting is likely the most critical, and it is also the easiest,
I sure don't need my TV to work in a power failure... so why bother connecting it to the system ?
same goes with lots of things
solar power water pumps would likely be set up as a separate system anyway, so don't think that you need one system to do everything. (or that it would be a good idea to have one system to run everything)
I can take pictures and show everyone what I have done to get my lighting off grid
that is if people want me to
(by the way, my entire system is all set up to be portable because I first set it up for camping trips where I was going to be using radio hardware)
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Post by jd4020 on Apr 6, 2016 20:24:31 GMT
This is what I would like. -I would like solar to run the water pump. Ideally, I would fill a tank that is situated in my basement underneath my kitchen sink. The sink would then have one of those little hand pumps. I would have other tanks to fill for watering our animals. I really would like to get the windmill fixed so it can bring up water for the animals. There are only a couple of blades missing. _The next solar would be to run the lights & fans as we also live where it is hot & humid. -The one youtube couple I've been watching just bought an inverter and recharge their phone and laptop when they are running their vehicle. I like that idea. Course, in an EMP attack that option would be out. -We have a longwood furnace that is going on 40 years old. It can be used to burn wood (what we do) or use LP gas. They don't make them anymore & not sure about the life span, it has been running just fine all these years. When the power is out, we do keep the fire going so the heat is there just not the blower fan to move it more effectively throughout the house. So a panel for that. -I suppose the last solar use would be enough panels to keep the fridge going, although, I am not opposed to freezing water in gallon jugs or even gallon buckets in winter & storing in an ice house to use in the fridge as needed. Since I have the knowledge & equipment to can up almost anything, freezers would not be a need. We do have some electrical appliances but mostly use the non electric ones so no worries there. I have no idea how many panels, wiring, batteries etc. I would need to have this power. When I have tried to sit down & figure it out, my brain just goes to white fuzz. Maybe some day. |
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Post by claytonpiano on Apr 6, 2016 23:00:28 GMT
We have solar, are grid tied and have battery backups. With the rebates and other incentives, it made sense to us to have solar. Our air conditioner/heat pump is on-grid should the canning just get overwhelming in the summer.....then I can turn the air conditioner on. We did not use the heater at all this winter, but we do have a wood stove. As to what can actually run on the solar......several cloudy days using freezers, refrigerators and the well pump will drain batteries quickly. Whenever it is not sunny and you are off-grid then the rationing begins. It is not terrible and we are careful, but it is something to consider. Even using the air conditioner we are saving nearly $300 per month in power plus selling some back to the grid.
We love our solar, but if you are thinking that things will run the same and only use solar, that is not possible. It requires reading the monitor during consecutive rainy days.
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Post by jd4020 on Apr 7, 2016 11:43:23 GMT
claytonpiano, how do you do that in terms of wiring? Do you have to re-wire the existing plug outlets right to the batteries for the appliances that are on solar? and leave the air conditioner/heat pump on the regular plug outlets? Just curious, I understand what you are saying about cloudy days & such. And I like the idea of leaving some tied to the grid if needed. Best of both it would seem.
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Post by claytonpiano on Apr 7, 2016 23:55:57 GMT
We have a sub panel that goes from the solar to the batteries to the solar sub panel to the plugs. The other things run off the regular AC sub panel. The solar sub panel is next to the AC sub panel so that you can just move the existing wire to whatever sub panel it needs to be in. I am typing this as DH is talking and attempting to explain it to us. We bought ours from wholesalesolar.com. They gave us a drawing/diagram and we hired an electrician to do some of the work due to our local building code. Our electrician stood and explained it to the inspector. That was the worst part. The inspector knew nothing about solar and was challenged but kind to us since we had a licensed electrician. It was just one of the hoops we had to jump through.
Now, I wish I understood that explanation, but with the division of duties here on the homestead.......I gladly passed this one to DH, although I do know how to flip the switch to turn the grid off and how to check the batteries for water.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2016 2:59:43 GMT
You guys that get rebates and benefits from solar energy are really lucky. Unless you're totally off grid, as more people move towards solar/alternative energy for at least part of their daily needs the power companies here are looking at increasing power charges on the basis that they still want to maintain their profits.
The pricing structure here is split in two parts - a fixed line charge for the infrastructure/supply costs, and the actual amount of power you use. If more people move towards solar/alternative energy, profits go down, so companies will just up their charges to ensure they're maintained. Unless they target solar/alternative users exclusively for these increases, everyone else will have to pay to make up the difference. It's the same as when prices go up as a general thing - if you cut back on the power you're using, they up the fixed lines charges. Screwed either way!
On one hand the government supports initiatives like solar power (which is great), yet does nothing to curb the rapaciousness of the largely overseas-owned power companies greed. People here who are considering moving to solar power are advised to really do their homework on the length of time it will take to break even on the installation costs, which are still quite high here.
But it's encouraging to see that people's uptake of alternative energy isn't the crazy idea that people thought it was 20 years ago.
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Post by spacecase0 on Apr 9, 2016 17:10:47 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2016 17:30:18 GMT
A lot of the infrastructure that supports solar will also work with the energy supplied by a hydro or wind gene.
Something to consider - if "one is none", then also plan a redundancy into your off-grid power!
On days your solar isn't charging because of weather, perhaps your wind turbine can pick up that slack caused by the weather... :-D
Folks with a stream, it turns a paddle day and night, fair and foul. As long as the creek doesn't dry up. (And if it dried up, was that because of sunshine? LOL! )
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Post by graywolf on Apr 9, 2016 22:11:30 GMT
If you are totally off-grid, and live almost anywhere I can think of, you WILL need a generator at some point in time. You could have tons of panels and lots of batteries but there will be winter weeks where the sun just doesn't shine. Wire your place accordingly from the start.
Also, it's common for people to think of a cheap 12 volt system as that is something they are accustomed to in their car. Don't do it. Go with at least 48 volts. The wire sizes are smaller and the inverter efficiency is higher.
Start with a sine wave inverter ...cost more...works better.
We had a 3,500 sq ft home in eastern WA that was totally off grid from 2004 to 2015. Been there. Done that. Fun but you have to be involved with the system and understand how it works. I've seen a neighbor ruin a $4,000 set of batteries in a week with the wrong system settings. Study. Study. Study. Then buy.
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Post by jassytoo on Apr 9, 2016 22:59:43 GMT
graywolf, I just read the message under your photo. Please except my condolences, I'm so sorry.
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Post by spacecase0 on Apr 10, 2016 0:14:04 GMT
If you are totally off-grid, and live almost anywhere I can think of, you WILL need a generator at some point in time. You could have tons of panels and lots of batteries but there will be winter weeks where the sun just doesn't shine. Wire your place accordingly from the start. Also, it's common for people to think of a cheap 12 volt system as that is something they are accustomed to in their car. Don't do it. Go with at least 48 volts. The wire sizes are smaller and the inverter efficiency is higher. Start with a sine wave inverter ...cost more...works better. We had a 3,500 sq ft home in eastern WA that was totally off grid from 2004 to 2015. Been there. Done that. Fun but you have to be involved with the system and understand how it works. I've seen a neighbor ruin a $4,000 set of batteries in a week with the wrong system settings. Study. Study. Study. Then buy. I know only one person to have a large 12V system, and it is kind of a pain I like a separate small system 12V system just for lights in case the main system fails, but would not try running major appliances on it and you are very correct, watch your battery voltages and know what the limits are it is why I like the nickel iron battery systems, very very hard to mess them up |
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Post by graywolf on Apr 10, 2016 1:05:38 GMT
A point on DC lighting. A 'normal' light switch that you cheaply get at Home Despot or ____ is designed to operate using AC and has contacts that only open a little bit. DC wants a switch that 'clicks' when opening and closing -- it is opening far enough that DC won't arc and weld it shut. Modern switches can only handle a low amp DC load, if that. Look on the box and see what DC capability is.
If you are wiring DC outlets, get ones that won't accept a standard household plug. You want to be sure nobody plugs 120 volt AC things into your DC system, or DC stuff into 120 AC. Look at the ones with slanted plugs. They cost more but safer.
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Post by spacecase0 on Apr 10, 2016 3:25:44 GMT
I ended up using powerpole plugs powerwerx.com/anderson-power-powerpole-sb-connectorsthey have no gender, so everything plugs into everything else, and they look nothing like a 120VAC plug I have tested the standard household lighting switches on DC, I know they are not rated for much DC, but at 50A they still seem to break the circuit... (only tested it a few hundred times (inductive load if anyone cares)) have had one in use on a 1A 12V LED light for many years now with no issues at all, but then I also know that I can't totally trust it to turn off, I use to turn on and off lights with plugging/unplugging the powerpole connectors (they are rated for that), just a bit hard to plug the first one in in the dark, but if my switch fails, that is how I will shut it off also proper DC switches are not to much to buy, it is just that I did not have any when I set things up my DC system was also made the way it is because I am not allowed to modify the building I am in, so it is all power cords on floor and switches taped to the wall |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2016 15:46:59 GMT
... my DC system was also made the way it is because I am not allowed to modify the building I am in, so it is all power cords on floor and switches taped to the wall Isn't it amazing at what your ingenuity will invent when you really-really want something, but aren't quite able to do it?! I bet you are learning lots and will be full-on ready when you get to make Your System later! |
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Post by spacecase0 on Apr 10, 2016 16:22:23 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2016 21:29:09 GMT
I'm sorry if that sounded belittling. It wasn't meant to sound that way... I was smiling at your description of making due with what you could since you couldn't permanently alter your casa. I was admiring it! Ingenious!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2016 14:44:41 GMT
I live off the grid too. We have a 12-volt system which started out extremely small. Overtime we have built it larger and added more components and are now able to use more electrical items. Not sure what you want to know about living this way, but ask some questions, I am sure someone will answer them.
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