Conservor Hybrid Shallot

[here to stay]

I grew these for the first year in addition to Dutch, French Grey and Yellow Multipliers.  It is a different kind, being  a large, elongated bulb with fewer than usual in its clusters.   While the bulbs are individually large, the number per square foot is somewhat less.  It peels easily and is mild in taste.

What was a very pleasant surprise was that it did not raise havoc with my digestion as everything from green onions to other shallots do.  I love my onion family but it is chancy as to what effect they will have, especially raw.  This has been great so far.

The catalog says it's suppose to last well and can be raised from seed, although I did used sets.  So i can't comment on it.  But I like it well enough to expand my planting of it at the expense of the others.  

[paquebot]

What you have already found out is that it is not really a shallot. The Dutch developed it and the French immediately cried foul. True shallots do not produce seeds. Echalions/banana shallots, do produce seeds but they are somewhere between a shallot and onion but neither. The hybrids are not supposed to divide more than once or twice. The aim is to get big ones and that doesn't happen when there are a lot of them. If the bulbs are planted back. they will divide into 2 or 3 bulbs and bolt to seed just like an onion.

Martin

[here to stay]

I had up to 4 bulbs per bulb planted. A lot of 3s,a few 2s or 1s. They had almost all bolted and I was not happy, thinking that this would damage the bulbs like it does with onions. But what happened was the flower stalk was off to one side, attached to the bulb by one thin layer. I broke off the stalk and it left me with an undamaged bulb.

[here to stay]

And the response is-

"SHALLOT

The shallot is a true biennial. Its natural cycle, like that of most alliums, is to develop a bulb one year and then bloom the next. However, shallots, unlike onions, have been developed from clones for such a long time that they have lost the ability to produce flowers. Or, if they do blossom, the flowers are sterile. That’s why shallots must be reproduced by replanting bulbs harvested the previous season.

I hope this helps!
RaNae"

Not really helpful to the question I think.

[here to stay]

So a further question about it being a true shallot got this respnse-
"Thank you. Our catalog states that it is a hybrid, however, you aren't planting the seed, you are planting the bulb which is not the same issue as planting the seed.
RaNae
TSc"

Which I suppose is true but totally irrelevant. I'm just going to have to wait to find out.

[paquebot]

Sept 25, 2017 18:12:11 GMT here to stay said:

And the response is-

"SHALLOT

The shallot is a true biennial. Its natural cycle, like that of most alliums, is to develop a bulb one year and then bloom the next. However, shallots, unlike onions, have been developed from clones for such a long time that they have lost the ability to produce flowers. Or, if they do blossom, the flowers are sterile. That’s why shallots must be reproduced by replanting bulbs harvested the previous season.

I hope this helps!
RaNae"

Not really helpful to the question I think.

That is totally contradictory!  It's only been in recent years that these things have been developed.  Before that, no shallot ever produced seeds perhaps for thousands of years.  Until then, shallots could not be a biennial since they produced no seeds.  Same applies to multiplying onions.  Consider what they told you.  Plant seed one year to get a bulb.  Plant the bulb back to get seeds.  The usual purpose of planting shallot bulbs is to make more bulbs, right?  John Best liked to say that 90% of the people who write about gardening have never set foot in one.  Possibly applies in this case, too.

Martin     

[1shotwade]

So, just to clarify, these lame responses are from Territorial?
Wade

[paquebot]

It's only been since the 1990s that the Dutch growers developed a "shallot" which produces seeds. Since all of the commercial seed is F1 hybrid, that means that there are two parents which may or may not be shallots. Someone like Territorial may look at the description for banana shallots and use that. What they gave applies 100% to banana shallots except that they are echalion. Echalions are onions which have many qualities of a shallot but an onion nevertheless. When you think of it, that sounds very much like the "Echalotes de semis", as the French call the hybrids.

Martin

[here to stay]

Sept 25, 2017 21:42:40 GMT 1shotwade said:

So, just to clarify, these lame responses are from Territorial?
Wade

Yes.  And they win again.  I gave up last time and now I will give up again.

[paquebot]

Looked at all of their shallot offerings with amusement. They use the same information for all. One is to expect 4-5 times the amount planted. That's true for true shallots but obviously does not apply to Conservor which is supposed to bolt rather than divide. Buyer beware. Sometimes wonder is a little knowledge is dangerous. Life for all would be so much easier if we all were ignorant!

Martin

[1shotwade]

Sept 25, 2017 22:38:45 GMT here to stay said:

Sept 25, 2017 21:42:40 GMT 1shotwade said:

So, just to clarify, these lame responses are from Territorial?
Wade

Yes.  And they win again.  I gave up last time and now I will give up again.

I wouldn't call that a win! They just joined my list of who not to deal with!
Wade

[here to stay]

paquebot, I don't know what to make of them. I planted a single bulb that multiplied. Then each multiple flowered while the origional bulb disappeared in the center.

What I have left is a new bulb or more that looks just like the one I planted but with a flower stalk off to one side. Unlike regular onions, the quality of the bulb is as good as the ones I planted but no bigger.

I don't know what the next step will be if I plant these new 'stalked' bulbs. I guess I will try it and see.

[paquebot]

You plant a single bulb. It is typical of an onion in that it is merely stored energy to produce seed and is used up in the process. But it also produces another bulb, typical of some other alliums. I should think that you see what's wrong with that picture from a vegetable gardener's view. You plant one and get one in return. Eat one and there's nothing to replace it. That makes it ornamental rather than useful.

I have one similar to that and have no idea what it is. An old Hmong gardener grows it. It's planted from seed and they use it like a green onion for cooking. By fall, there's a bulb just about an inch diameter. I planted some back last fall and most only divided once to produce 2 bulbs just less than 2" and a seed stalk. Although it very much resembles a shallot in many ways, its growth pattern says that it is something else in the vast allium family.

Martin

[here to stay]

paquebot, most of the bulbs did divide. Just not at the rate that my other multipliers do. But if I can count on it doubling or tripling over all, I would grow it on as I really like it.

I just don't know if it has the disease resistence not to decline with each subsequent planting or even if the bulbs will multiply from this year's crop. I think they will as they look as good as the ones I bought. But getting them up to enough volume with such low division rates will take lots of time. And I hate to invest the effort if it is doomed.

[paquebot]

Sept 26, 2017 16:52:57 GMT here to stay said:

paquebot , most of the bulbs did divide. Just not at the rate that my other multipliers do. But if I can count on it doubling or tripling over all, I would grow it on as I really like it.

I just don't know if it has the disease resistence not to decline with each subsequent planting or even if the bulbs will multiply from this year's crop. I think they will as they look as good as the ones I bought. But getting them up to enough volume with such low division rates will take lots of time. And I hate to invest the effort if it is doomed.

Inasmuch as you're bent on growing something in a manner which it was not intended, not much more than anyone can add. You'll just have to do whatever you want to do and what you get or don't get will be your own doing, no one else's.

Martin

[here to stay]

Well stubborn is certain something I am.

I think I have gathered enough information to have a good idea of what the result would be. Most likely the new bulbs would also send up stalks if planted. The problems with the stalks would be if they don't dry when the bulb is ready to be harvested, the bulbs will not have the dried uninterrupted skjn they need to last.

So if I do plant them, it would be likely I would need to use or dehyrate them fairly fast. I could plant back as they would certainly last long enough for that.

I will give it a go.  I really like their taste.

[jeannette]

Sept 25, 2017 21:16:00 GMT paquebot said:

Sept 25, 2017 18:12:11 GMT here to stay said:

And the response is-

"SHALLOT

The shallot is a true biennial. Its natural cycle, like that of most alliums, is to develop a bulb one year and then bloom the next. However, shallots, unlike onions, have been developed from clones for such a long time that they have lost the ability to produce flowers. Or, if they do blossom, the flowers are sterile. That’s why shallots must be reproduced by replanting bulbs harvested the previous season.

I hope this helps!
RaNae"

Not really helpful to the question I think.

That is totally contradictory!  It's only been in recent years that these things have been developed.  Before that, no shallot ever produced seeds perhaps for thousands of years.  Until then, shallots could not be a biennial since they produced no seeds.  Same applies to multiplying onions.  Consider what they told you.  Plant seed one year to get a bulb.  Plant the bulb back to get seeds.  The usual purpose of planting shallot bulbs is to make more bulbs, right?  John Best liked to say that 90% of the people who write about gardening have never set foot in one.  Possibly applies in this case, too.

Martin     

[jeannette]

I am new to shallot gardening, and all things onion, for that matter. Last fall(2020), I planted some shallots that were in my pantry from my restaurant since 2019. Not knowing the variety, I planted them anyway. In the spring of 2021, they sent up blooms alongside of the bulb, which I promptly cut off, but they also multiplied. The first set I dug up had 9 lovely bulbs from the one mother bulb. Many of the shallots were palm sized, a few even larger. I later found out that I had planted the Conservor variety of shallots. Because I read that the shallots that bloomed would not keep as well, I have been careful to check them frequently. They taste great and are holding up well. I just planted some of this summer's crop to see if I can get the same wonderful results next year.

I do have a question for you veteran shallot growers. As I understand it, this shallot "set" is now in the start of its 2nd year cycle, and would expect it to send up a flower. But if the multiplier bulbs are the new growth, why would these offspring also send up a flower if they aren't yet in their 2nd year? That has me flummoxed.